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Gwynedd says no to new Prince of Wales – authority votes against another investiture, says title should be abolished

06 Oct 2022 4 minute read
The past and future Prince of Wales. Picture by Justin Tallis / PA Wire.

The local authority where Charles was crowned Prince of Wales has voted against an investiture for his son William, and said that the title itself should be abolished.

Councillors at Gwynedd voted by 46 votes to four to declare their opposition to the continuation of the title of ‘Prince of Wales’, and against holding another investiture in Wales. Four councillors abstained.

It comes after a petition against continuing with the Prince of Wales title has now attracted more than 35,000 signatures.

The motion was submitted by Blaenau Ffestiniog Councillor for Bowydd a Rhiw, Elfed Wyn ap Elwyn.

He said before the vote that he strongly believed that the title Prince of Wales continues the historical symbol of dominance held over Wales by the Royal Family of another country.

“Wales today is a modern, democratic country, with a Senedd making progress, giving the people of Wales a voice and a platform to drive change and develop as a nation,” he said.

“This archaic oppressive tradition is a blight on our nation and has been for centuries. It gives the impression that the people of Wales are owned by the system, rather than being free citizens living in our own country.

“It is holding us back from stepping out independently and making our own way in the world. In my view, this is the time for the people of Wales to be given the opportunity to make our voice heard and abolish this insulting title passed on from gentry as a continued oppressive symbol on our land and our people.

“It makes no sense, in my view that so much public money is used to sustain the Royal family, including the Prince of Wales role, given the cost of living crisis that our people are suffering up and down the country.”

Prince William of Wales. Picture by Matt Dunham / PA Wire. Right, Elfed Wyn ap Elwyn

The vote happened in the Gwynedd Council building just across the street from Caernarfon Castle where the investiture took place.

The Royal Family have already hinted that a new investiture would be a low-key affair, and sources briefed the Telegraph that the ceremony could happen at Llandaf Cathedral in Cardiff rather than in Caernarfon as was previously the case.

On a visit to Wales last week, Prince William himself is reported to have said that there were no current plans for an investiture.

‘History books’

The Royal title was originally given to Edward II of Caernarfon, son of Edward I who conquered Wales, as a means of confirming that the ‘Tywysog Cymru’ title previously held by native princes of Wales was subservient to that of the King of England.

Since then it has been held by 21 different heirs to the throne, although seven of them never became king.

There have previously been long periods of history, such as between 1553 with the accession of Edward Tudor and the passing of the title to Henry Frederick Stuart 63 years later, when the title did not exist at all.

Cllr Wyn ap Elwyn said he believed that the investiture of 1969 divided the nation, created ill-feeling and irreparable damage within communities.

Elfed Wyn ap Elwyn said: “My Cymru is one where I hope my baby twin boys are born to a fair and equal Wales, where no one places upon us a social class, symbolism or stature that affects our proud Welsh entity. The people of Wales should be free to make our own choices and be free of any symbolic shackle placed upon us.

“In my view, it would be a complete and utter sin to entertain the idea of a ceremonial pageantry be held anywhere in Wales. It would be an insult to Wales and its people to hold an Investiture ceremony on Welsh soil.

“The days of Wales titled ‘a little principality’ was abolished in the sixteenth century’s Laws in Wales Act. It is high time the so-called honourary title, Prince of Wales, was also abolished to the history books.”


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Gareth Cemlyn Jones
Gareth Cemlyn Jones
1 month ago

Da iawn Gwynedd. Pwysig fod Ynys Mon yn dilyn mor fuan a phosib neu mi fyddwn am byth yn cael ein hystyried fel y Sir ddaru rhoi lloches i’r cwpl enwog!

Jeremy Turner
Jeremy Turner
1 month ago

Da!

Mr Williams
Mr Williams
1 month ago

Ardderchog Gwynedd. Come on now rest of Wales’ counties, follow suit please!

Androw Bennett
Androw Bennett
1 month ago

Llongyfarchiadau i Gyngor Gwynedd! Synnwyr cyffredin yn goroesi taeogrwydd.
Congratulations Gwynedd Council. Common Sense overrides submissiveness.

Ceramike
Ceramike
1 month ago

Can’t wait for the predictable backlash from RT Davies and the Tory press barons, as subservience to the English crown is no longer the accepted status quo.

Aled Rees
Aled Rees
1 month ago

Da iawn Gwynedd.Proud to be a son of meirion today.Come on the rest of Wales.
I bet r2d2 is apoplectic with rage with his face turning piws.

Y Cymro
Y Cymro
1 month ago

Diolch Cyngor Gwynedd. You are not only the custodian of Welsh culture but the moral compass lacking. The Prince of Wales title should be abolished. No if or buts. It’s an archaic insult towards the people of Wales and should be consigned to the history books.

Last edited 1 month ago by Y Cymro
Frank
Frank
1 month ago
Reply to  Y Cymro

Clyw clyw.

Frank
Frank
1 month ago

Da arnoch Gwynedd.

Mab Meirion
Mab Meirion
1 month ago

Don’t stop there, get rid of the Lords, Sirs and Baronesses and the Deputy Lord Lieutenants, the whole damned lot…get rid of them…

Owain Morgan
Owain Morgan
1 month ago

Dyma’r arbennig o dda! 😄 Ceredigion next?

Alun Gerrard
Alun Gerrard
1 month ago

There are far more important issues for the council to sort out. The new prince has already voted for xmas. There will be no investiture and the title is just a title. This matter is proof that councillors can not have two masters….the people of Gwynedd and their political masters.

Maz
Maz
1 month ago

Well done Wales. The Dukes, Earls and other hangers on should be next.

Celtic prince
Celtic prince
1 month ago

Wasn’t this the same “county” that voted against the assembly 🤔

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