‘They’re taking over!’: Local bemused as Welsh language road sign appears in Winchester
There was bemusement in Winchester this week as a road sign in the Welsh language appeared in the Hampshire town, which is a 95-mile drive from Welsh border.
The sign placed near some roadworks on Teg Down Meads read ‘Llwybr Troed ar Gau’ or ‘Footpath Closed’ in English.
Linda Kay, of Goring Field, posted an image of the sign online, saying: “Welsh road signs spotted at the bottom of Teg Down Meads! They will be taking over next!
“Can someone please tell me why at Teg Down we have road signs in the Welsh language? It can’t just be for me, cos I’m only half Welsh!”
The road sign later came to the attention of the local paper, the Basingstoke Gazette and Hampshire Chronicle, both of which ran news articles on the phenomenon.
“The last time a Celtic language was widely used in the area would have been around 1,500 years ago, as the invading Anglo-Saxons from the south and the east pushed the native Britons out of the area and all the way westwards to Cornwall and Wales,” the Basingstoke Gazette said.
One online commentator on the article translated the sign: “It says, ‘I am lost please help me boyo’.”
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That newspaper will be in trouble.
Reminding the people down there that their Anglo-Sxon ancestors displaced the native Britons to Wales and Cornwall.
Historically incorrect too. There was no pushing of anyone anywhere. There was also no Anglo Saxon invasion. There was a fashion for Saxons to marry into the leadership of local tribes to secure land for a small number of migrants. There is no more than a paltry 5% Saxon DNA in the gene pool. The people of Winchester are Britons who have bene incorrectly convinced that they are Anglo Saxon
You know that scene where Adam Sandler gets awarded no points? You should watch it Chris!
No I don’t know it. I don’t watch children’s films.
I doubt it is relevant here anyway. Just your attempt at a put down having been presented with facts you don’t like
Except you used no facts Chris ,you presented a narrative to explain something,it’s a theory,and one with more holes than a fishing net.
Well it’s a message board not an educational portal. The leading geneticist Stephen Oppenheimer in 2005 carried out with Oxford University a DNA study to try and determine the genetic origins of the traditionally British people. He found that the “British” genome contained no more than 5% each of the “invaders’” genetic material, thereby disproving all population displacement via invasion and slaughter theories. This 5% is broadly standard across Norman, Saxon, Roman and “Celtic”. The facts support the Romans invading, intermarrying, then depopulating much of the island when a large chunk of the population with them when they left to… Read more »
… but the same model does not work for the Saxons and Normans – who stayed.
The Normans came with a small army and took over all of England in under 2 months. It took 500 years to realistically claim rulership of Wales. They did not mingle with the local population. Just with the families of the kingdoms. Hence their 5%. This is also borne out by the known historical record….
… however, the received history claims a massive Saxon army slaughtered or “drove” the Welsh into the west. But we’re this true there would be more than 5% Saxon DNA in the gene pool of the English. Whereas in fact there is about the same as in the Welsh. The Saxons never ruled over Wales so the model of the Normans does not work for them. Barry Cunliffe, THE leading expert on the British population has provided the most compelling theory. That Apart from in Kent and Sussex, where tribes reasonably described as Saxon had been established as long as… Read more »
… I look forward to your lengthy detailed rebuttal with current and credible sources. y k’now, since that’s what you demanded of me and I provided
I’m wary of purported correlations between particular genetic markers and particular cultures, because of sampling biases. Most human genetic diversity occurs in Africa, whereas the volunteers for human genetic studies tend to live in the urban parts of Europe, East Asia and North America. If more Africans were sampled, the picture might change! This kind of thing can be fun, and I enjoy watching academic dogma being demolished by reports of Neanderthal or Denisovan DNA in modern humans, but you have to feel sorry for the folks who pay to get some/all (?) their DNA sequenced, and then get sent… Read more »
Thank you. Someone who understands the science of it. Yes it is something that needs to be considered carefully, when using a mix of proxy modern populations to represent ancient cultural groups and some residual key available ancient DNA. But it helps when you can find relatively remote farming populations as with the farming populations of North Wales, that effectively proved – with a high degree of accuracy – the link with the Iberian peninsula. The Oxford study is not comprehensive, but it achieved its aim very successfully. As an incidental finding, the most Saxon of the English are in… Read more »
It’s a theory Chris ,that your espousing ,like most historical ones the fit in with whatever is culturally fashionable at the time.Marry into the local leadership? Sounds like taking the Norman conquest model and shoehorning it into this time period.
It clearly isn’t. I have posted my sources. Your opinion is worthless without you posting yours.
The archaeological record and the DNA record is with me. You have only outdated discredited theories built on jingoistic notions of English exceptionalism.
Common Brythonic survived in Wales only because … people voluntarily decided to move to Wales? Nonsense
Not what I said at all. Is English not your first language? The Britons stayed exactly where they were. Just the ones in what is now England eventually adopted the Saxon culture. Like they adopted the Celtic and Roman cultures before them. Just like they now adopt so much of American culture.
Another fallacy is the Norman invasion, what actually happened was that the Norman’s just came over selling onions, on their push bikes and married into the local population.
I’ve given you solid facts. I can’t do your thinking for you. The Normans conquered the whole of England in less time than it takes the average man to grow a beard. They never really took more than parts of Wales .this is borne out by the historic, archaeological and genetic record.
Please your embarrassing yourself people of Winchester are the original Britons. The only original Britons are in West Wales, Cornwall, Brittany…
Well I am in agreement with the foremost expert on the topic, Professor Barry Cunliffe of Oxford University and of the lead historian on the Oxford DNA study.
But yes, I’m embarrassing myself in front of some uneducated “patriots” who don’t even know they are not descended from more than a handful of Saxons.
Sorry if the truth of your heritage offends you.
Absolutely agree with you, Chris… DNA doesn’t lie (although it’s not yet a perfect science). Interesting too that the Win part of Winchester probably comes from Cymraeg “wyn” meaning “white” or “fair, beautiful, holy or pure”. And that the road the sign was placed on is called “Teg Down Meads” … “Teg” meaning “fair, beautiful, pretty.” People forget that the original language of Britain is Cymraeg.
They should be so lucky. Sorry folks. You’re stuck with Boris
Teg Down looks half Welsh to me anyway!
What’s the big deal English signs are all over Wales
Maybe not much happens in Teg Down Meads. But perhaps we shouldn’t laugh. Nation Cymru reported on it
I have never been called Boyo.
Same. Don’t think any Cymro has said it since the 1970s
Not sure if it was ever used enough to warrant the stereotype. The Irish use it quite a bit. Only heard a handful of non-welsh speakers from the valleys use it, seemingly because they think that’s something we say further west. Butt, mush and boi (shw ti boi?) but never heard boyo (unironically)
To Chris you said – ‘The leading geneticist Stephen Oppenheimer in 2005 carried out with Oxford University a DNA study to try and determine the genetic origins of the traditionally British people. He found that the “British” genome contained no more than 5% each of the “invaders’” ‘ It appears that you are not aware that Stephen Oppenheimer is not a ‘leading geneticist at least when it comes to the genetic origins of the British. https:https://www.anthro.ox.ac.uk/sites/default/files/anthro/documents/media/stephen_oppenheimer_publications_1976-2009.pdf He wrote a book –The Origins of the British: a genetic detective story in 2006 but as far as I know he has never subjected… Read more »
It saddens me to see that this trivial matter has attracted 22 comments, whilst the reports ‘ WG unveils plans to tackle second homes ..’ and ‘Government urged to close second homes tax loophole’ has hardly merited a handful of comments! Where are your priorities pray?
The two stories don’t have a direct option to type endless prattle like :”they won’t like being reminded of their ancestors”
“They” won’t give a toss.
At least it wasn’t the sign where someone printed an an email out of office reply.
Yes. You don’t like being reminded of your ancestors though eh? You though you were descended from Saxons (you weren’t. You’re just the gullible version of us). You thought your Saxon ancestors conquered the British (they didn’t. There weren’t enough of them to have been more than migrants) that England conquered and absorbed Wales (it didn’t).
And now you are upset because you don’t like the facts
As a Hampshire Hog with Welsh roots, you’re all welcome in Caerwynt anytime.
Teg Downs Mead. Could that be Teg as in Tylwyth Teg? Fairy Downs Mead?