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Prince of Wales investiture ‘a decision that should be made in Wales’ says Plaid Cymru leader

13 Sep 2022 6 minute read
Adam Price picture by Plaid Cymru. Prince William of Wales. Picture by Matt Dunham / PA Wire

The leader of Plaid Cymru Adam Price has said that any decision over the investiture of the new Prince of Wales should be made in Wales.

His comments come after over 20,000 people signed a petition opposing the passing on of the controversial title to Prince William.

Adam Price had originally said on Friday that while there would be “a time” for a public debate around the title, at the moment Plaid Cymru’s thoughts were “with the Royal Family as they grieve”.

However, in comments made to Radio Cymru he said that discussions about where the investiture should take place in the media had “crossed a line”.

His comments came after First Minister Mark Drakeford said on Sunday and yesterday that there was “no rush” to another investiture and that a discussion should take place in the meantime.

Adam Price added: “I welcome what the First Minister, Mark Drakeford, had to say on the question of an investiture.

“I’ve seen stories in the London press that an investiture is going to happen and I think that a line is crossed because that gives the Prince of Wales a quasi-official status in Welsh life.

“I think that’s a decision that we in Wales should make in a time when we’re living in a modern democratic Wales – it’s a decision we need to make here before any announcement is made.”

He added that there should be no rush to make a decision but that it was one for Members of the Senedd to make.

“I’m a republican, and there is sensitivity and pain around the [Prince of Wales] title for many of us,” he said. “But others have a different view and we need a discussion on the matter.”

‘Responsibilities’

Yesterday Mark Drakeford said that there is a “discussion” to be had about on an elected Head of State, but it should not be had this week.

In an interview with ITV’s Sharp End, the First Minister said that there needed to be a focus on mourning the Queen.

Asked by presenter Rob Osborne whether there should be a debate on the issue, he said: “Well, not this week.

“I think there’s a discussion there,” he said. “It’s alive and happening already. But this week is a week about reflecting on the life, the service, the memories that people have of someone who has been part of everybody’s life.”

He once again confirmed that he wasn’t consulted before the creation of the title of Prince of Wales for Prince William, but said that he hadn’t expected to be.

“No, wouldn’t expect to be there’s no constitutional significance in the role of the Prince of Wales,” he said. “It doesn’t have responsibilities of its own.

“I think it’s a decision that the king has made and in some ways that has avoided what might have been a drawn-out debate about whether or not it should happen.”

Mark Drakeford picture by Ben Birchall / PA Wire.

‘No hurry’

On Sunday the First Minister had said he was not told there would be a new Prince of Wales before King Charles’ announcement and says there’s no rush to investiture so that “a debate” can be had.

Mark Drakeford told Radio Cymru that “attitudes had changed” since the last investiture in 1969 and that Prince William needed to come to Wales and find out “where he can make a difference”.

“I hadn’t heard anything about it before the new King said it,” he said. “He said it very early in his new period. He had thought about that for a long time in terms of what he wanted to say.

“The role of the Prince of Wales isn’t a constitutional one. But in the Royal Family, it’s an important one.”

Asked if an investiture was imminent, he added: “I had no chance to ask about that – and there’s no hurry. Of course, this week everything is happening quickly and that’s necessary.

“But a lot of what is going to happen now after the funeral on Monday and there will be more time to think about the best way and opportunities for the new Prince to come to Wales and learn more about the priorities of the people of Wales. And see where he can make a difference.

“So there’s no hurry to do anything else I don’t think.”

Asked whether he thought the Royal Family were sensitive to the strength of feeling about the role of the Prince of Wales, he said: “I think they are. I think they know that Wales in 2022 is not Wales as it was in 1969. A lot of things have changed – attitudes have changed as well.

“That’s why I think that the best way is not to hurry to do other things but to take time. To come to Wales to meet with people, to think about what the new Prince of Wales can do effectively. If there’s a debate to be had, to give a chance to that debate.”

‘Cofia 1282’, a protest against the investiture of Prince Charles at Caernarfon Castle in North Wales. By Geoff Charles. This image is available from the National Library of Wales

History

King Charles III announced that he was making William and Kate the new Prince and Princess of Wales during his first speech on Friday.

The King said he was creating his son and heir, William, Prince of Wales adding: “With Catherine beside him, our new Prince and Princess of Wales will, I know, continue to inspire and lead our national conversations, helping to bring the marginal to the centre ground where vital help can be given.”

But a petition calling for the Royals to “end Prince of Wales title out of respect for Wales” surged to 20,000 signatures over the next few days.

The petition says that since the days of the Welsh Princes the title has been “held exclusively by Englishmen as a symbol of dominance over Wales”.

“The title remains an insult to Wales and is a symbol of historical oppression and also implies that Wales is still a principality, undermining Wales’ status as a nation and a country,” the petition’s author, Trystan Gruffydd, said.

The Royal title was originally given to Edward II of Caernarfon, son of Edward I who conquered Wales, as a means of confirming that the ‘Tywysog Cymru’ title previously held by native princes of Wales was subservient to that of the King of England.

Since then it has been held by 21 different heirs to the throne, although seven of them never became king.

There have previously been long periods of history, such as between 1553 with the accession of Edward Tudor and the passing of the title to Henry Frederick Stuart 63 years later, when the title did not exist at all.


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Paul
Paul
13 days ago

The post-1282 Prince of Wales title has no legal or constitutional link to Wales. It was a PR stunt when Edward I first gave it to his son in 1301 and was still a PR stunt when investitures in Wales were initiated in 1911. The title is just empty words, like all territorial peerage titles (except Duke of Cornwall) so perhaps we should just ignore it.

SundanceKid
SundanceKid
13 days ago
Reply to  Paul

I’ll make an exception for Glyndwr who de facto assumed the title during his revolt. Otherwise, it is dead.

Richard 1
Richard 1
13 days ago

Keep it up, mssrs Drakeford and Price. Very sensible line.

Y Cymro
Y Cymro
13 days ago

Any decision to have a prince or not should be ours and ours alone not decided by an unelected English mafioso royal family & Westminster Tory government.

SundanceKid
SundanceKid
13 days ago

Drakeford and Price only coming out now with their vague and thinly veiled digs, after realising that the weight of public opinion is not necessarily on their side…

We know what they are thinking, but neither have the courage to say it out loud.

Last edited 13 days ago by SundanceKid
Cai Wogan Jones
Cai Wogan Jones
13 days ago

Never mind an investiture … the decision as to whether he should carry the Prince of Wales title should be made in Wales.

A title that has a uniquely offensive history. It was arrogated by the English monarchy to celebrate and symbolize the permanent subjugation of the Welsh.

Just as the Stone of Scone – seized by Edward Longshanks in 1296 – was returned to Scotland in 1996, the POW title must now be relinquished.

Argol fawr!
Argol fawr!
13 days ago

By the by, as councils such as Gwynedd awarded themselves a day off on Dydd Gwyl Dewi while the rest of us had to slog on. Shouldn’t they disregard Elizabeth’s funeral holiday on principal and turn up for work? 😈

Last edited 13 days ago by Argol fawr!
aled rees
aled rees
13 days ago
Reply to  Argol fawr!

Yes.

Brian Coman
Brian Coman
13 days ago

Put Wales on the Union Flag and the Royal Standard and maybe then we will think about it !

Peter Cuthbert
Peter Cuthbert
13 days ago
Reply to  Brian Coman

No thanks. Keep Wales off the British Union flag as we want to be out of the British Union not trapped in it. Now the European Union would be different….

Brian Clement
Brian Clement
13 days ago
Reply to  Brian Coman

That’s the very last thing we need

SundanceKid
SundanceKid
13 days ago
Reply to  Brian Coman

No! Not our country, not our flag.

David Charles pearn
David Charles pearn
10 days ago
Reply to  Brian Coman

Not a chance we will keep the dragon if you don’t mind the dragon is Welsh and stands proudly alone.

Richard
Richard
13 days ago

Now ER2 has passed after life time of service – an example for many politicos to follow – we must as a nation be consulted through real engament and discusion……

The 18 to 20 per cent repuplicans have their views which need to be respected as do the declining numbers of elderly monachists who we are told make up 40 per cent or so.

For the rest of us known by the opimion polldters as ‘ Elizabethans ‘ we i guess are wishing to look at what best suites a modern, diverse, tolerant and inclusive Wales ….

I.Humphrys
I.Humphrys
7 days ago

If the majority in Cymru choose William and Kate, I will go along with it.
Put it to a vote.

Gareth Wyn Jones
Gareth Wyn Jones
6 days ago

The English monarchy and our home grown Tudors have been the enemy of y Cymry since Edward the barbarian, that is a fact and nothing will change with the passing of the English queen. Carlo, nid fu mrenin

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