Reform UK defector clashes with former Conservative colleagues

Chris Haines, ICNN Senedd reporter

A Tory-turned-Reform Senedd member has clashed with her former Conservative colleagues in a fiery debate about NHS Wales following her high-profile defection.

Laura Anne Jones, who jumped ship to join Reform UK in July, was challenged over comments Nigel Farage has made on funding for the health service.

She said: “The people of Wales deserve the truth, not misinformation, even if it means that some of you will now have to update your Caerphilly by-election leaflets.

“When Reform forms a government next May, the NHS will remain free at the point of delivery, and free prescriptions will remain just that – free.

“Anyone suggesting otherwise is scaremongering.”

Darren Millar, who leads the Conservative group in the Welsh Parliament, intervened as his former colleague was contributing to the Tory debate.

‘Say sorry’

He said: “It’s wonderful to have the opportunity to speak to you, the first time we’ve done so since you decided to defect to Reform.

“Can I ask you: do you support your party leader and your party being a party that casts aspersions and doubts on the efficacy and safety of paracetamol and that supports Covid conspiracy theories about the efficacy and safety of Covid vaccines?

“I think the public in Wales deserve to know whether that is the case. What is your view?”

Ms Jones replied: “Well, I think that what’s important here is that we’re discussing the record of the Welsh Government. I love that you took so much interest, of course, in our Reform party conference and maybe you’d like to come one day, I don’t know.”

“Say sorry. Say sorry. Say sorry to him,” heckled Alun Davies, a Labour backbencher.

Peter Fox, a Conservative, accused Mr Farage of failing to stand up against false claims that paracetamol use during pregnancy is linked to autism.

‘Empty rhetoric’

“Wales doesn’t need unfounded conspiracy theorists running our health service,” said the former Monmouthshire council leader. “Reform is a party with no substance, no answers and just empty rhetoric from one man who tells everyone what they want to hear.”

Plaid Cymru’s Mabon ap Gwynfor also took the ex-Tory to task: “Here’s a quote from Nigel Farage, ‘I do not want the NHS funded through general taxation.’

“How else would you fund it here in Wales?”

Ms Jones replied: “Just because Nigel Farage has a special view on it,” prompting groans and interruptions from around the Senedd’s debating chamber.

“Being interested in how other countries manage their health services and looking if there are any parts of that that we can take and use in our NHS is very, very different to committing the NHS to be abolished or privatised.”

Conservative Janet Finch-Saunders said: “I have to say Laura, being honest with you, I’ve lost confidence in you as a politician. I’ve certainly never had any confidence in Reform, so I’d be careful … speaking on a health debate because we know what Mr Farage’s view is.”

‘Farage fantasy pill’

After May’s Senedd election, members who leave the political party they were elected to represent will no longer be able to cross the floor and must then sit as an independent.

The ill-tempered debate on September 24 also saw a clash between the Tories and Plaid, with the former accusing the latter of being “handmaidens” to Labour over NHS failures.

Llŷr Gruffydd raised a point of order: “Janet Finch-Saunders who I used to consider a friend and I hope that I will do after this, she did mislead the Senedd in suggesting that me and my party were doing everything we could to encourage illegal immigrants into this country.”

The Plaid Cymru politician added: “I would ask her to withdraw that statement. If she doesn’t she’s clearly another one who’s swallowed a Farage fantasy pill.”

“Oh no, absolutely not,” Ms Finch-Saunders responded, clarifying that she was speaking about the Welsh Government’s Nation of Sanctuary policy.

The rows overshadowed the Tory debate which heard more than 38,000 people have died while waiting for NHS treatment since the 2021 Senedd election.