‘Wales betrayed again’ in row over devolution of Police and Crime Commissioners
Martin Shipton
The UK Labour government has been accused of betraying Wales again after it emerged that while elected Mayors in England have been granted responsibility for police governance in their areas, the Welsh Government will have no such role in Wales.
It was recently announced that Police and Crime Commissioners (PCCs) in England and Wales will be abolished in 2028.
The elected PCC roles were first introduced by the Conservative UK government in 2012, but turnouts at elections have always been derisory and the concept has not captured the public’s imagination.
A well-placed political source told Nation.Cymru that the Westminster government has no intention of involving the Welsh Government in future police governance arrangements, but was happy for the likes of Greater Manchester Mayor Andy Burnham to have them.
We asked the Wales Office for a statement on the matter and were told by a UK government spokesperson: “The abolition of PCCs will save the UK taxpayer at least £100m and will help to fund front-line officers to cut crime.
“In Wales we will work closely with all stakeholders, including local and Welsh Government, to ensure that local police governance is effective, has the necessary powers to drive public safety and holds Chief Constables to account for their forces’ performance.
“The transition to the new model will happen at the end of the next electoral cycle in 2028.”
The spokesperson drew our attention to an exchange in the Commons between Caerfyrddin Plaid Cymru MP Ann Davies and Policing Minister Sarah Jones.
Ms Davies said: “May I thank[Dyfed-Powys PCC] Dafydd Llywelyn for his excellent work, especially on rural crime and domestic abuse. Today’s statement makes clear the absurd complexity of an England and Wales justice system.
“The UK Government will look to the Welsh Government to help replace the PCC system in Wales, but they have refused the same government powers over policing. Does the Secretary of State now concede that the Welsh Government is the best place to control policing in Wales, and that devolving the entire justice system to Wales makes logical sense?”
‘Structural changes’
Ms Jones responded: “We are very conscious that the system in Wales is different from the system in England, which is why we will take some time talking to stakeholders there, not least because Wales is not having a mayoral model. To be clear, this announcement is not about the devolution of policing, but structural changes to a model that simply was not working.”
Meanwhile former Plaid Cymru President Lord Dafydd Wigley received an answer in the House of Lords to his question about the matter which stated: “We will work with the Welsh Government and other stakeholders on arrangements to transfer PCC functions to local government leaders, recognising the unique nature of devolved arrangements in Wales.”
Plaid Cymru’s spokesperson for justice Adam Price MS said: “Keir Starmer says he’s a big believer in devolution. What he failed to mention is that he only believes in English devolution. He’s happy to listen to English mayoralties’ calls for powers over policing, yet it isn’t good enough for Wales.
“It is a disgrace that the only thing Labour’s so-called ‘partnership in power’ means for Wales, is that we’re ignored. One must ask what the point of Welsh Labour is, if they’re refusing to stand up for what Wales deserves against their own colleagues.
“Anything short of fully devolving policing is nonsensical when that is exactly what the Labour Welsh Government itself is seeking.
“Wales needs a government that will stand up for Wales at all times, a government that is answerable to the people of Wales, that isn’t scared of what their London bosses might think. Wales needs a Plaid Cymru government.”
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All eyes on the manifestos. Who will commit to devolving policing, prisons and justice?
Several parties, none of which have given much serious thought as to how it would work in practice.
Our local plaid MP once stood up at a local meeting and told us how important the devolving justice and policing was. They were asked by an audience, what would they do with the powers, and they had no response!
Yeah, I heard Rhun speak at a business event the other day and he was poorly briefed to say the least regarding the economy, how to build a successful one etc. Difficult as there was so much goodwill in the room but he stumbled badly a few times.
Genuinely think he is a very good person. Governing, making unpopular decisions will be a shock to plaid- as it is in England for reform
It seems obvious that Labour in London have written Wales off and are intent on rolling back devolution.
As the Welsh government are not prepared to challenge them and stand up for the Welsh people, we need to know what other parties are prepared to offer to help us have control over our lives
Westminster recognises the fact that there is no backbone in the Senedd and therefore treats it thus and walks all over them laughing their heads off at the same time. If we ever achieve independence we, the Cymry, had better start demanding a better quality of members in the Welsh Government.
VOTE for a party who wants INDEPENDENCE.
With the intended reduction in the number of police forces, watch out for a plan to jojn north Wales with merseyside and gtr manchester. Devolving policing to Wales would then be impossible…
This Westminster Labour government has surely quietly reverted, though without overt acknowledgement, to the disdain for devolution which very much characterized the Labour party fifty years ago.
Is it not just that policing is devolved in Manchester and not in wales?
Many people on the left are anti-devolution because they want a centrally planned state and they see devolution as an obstruction to this.
So two key questions to Starmer’s English Labour Party.
You’re using my username!
Wales suffered from same problems in England- low turnout, weak accountability, and zero impact on frontline performance or public confidence.
Policing remains a reserved matter, so Wales has no power to create a new policing governance system to replace PCCs.
So it will vw monitored through UK mechanisms; HMICFRS inspections, Home Office oversight and parliamentary scrutiny. You have been told that, you just didn’t listen!
Public support for the police in Wales ends in 2028.
From that date the pre-PSNI approach of Sinn Fein best be adopted. A police warrant card can only be given the consent of the people. See a copper being nutted in the street? Just turn the blind eye. Turn up on your doorstep requiring assistance? Dim Ateb. See a blue light in the rear view mirror? If it’s an ambulance or a fire engine, pull over, otherwise give them a finger.
No consent. Until we have a say in the way our country is policed.
If we did, we would inherit a police and justice system on its knees.
Careful what you wish for.
The police service has only one asset, it’s manpower.
Backed up by public support.
Courts are in a mess. Jails are in a mess. This is far more convoluted than just saying give us the powers.
I couldn’t agree more, and that’s a bit I can’t understand why people get upset about this. Devolving isn’t just a flick of the switch – it requires months and years of civil service planning and new legislation, at a time when policing and justice department is already in crisis and facing her real terms cut over the next 2 to 3 years. 99% of people of more concerned about the outcomes than who runs it. Sort out crisis, then worry about devolution. As for plaid, I believe they supported the removal of PCC’s…
Plaid Cymru removal of PCCs is conditional on their replacement with a policing minister elected to Senedd, same powers as the mayors of Manchester and London.
Yes – that is typical plaid response when someone does something they actually want. ‘Yeah, but ..”
PCC should never have happened. But the removal should mean a drop in council rates? My bill says £300 or so to the PCC. Time will tell.
Of course not. When have you ever seen council tax go down?!
The precept will remain but overseen by Parliament, HMICFRS inspections, and presumably police authorities.
Basically this change is just removing the PCC
All rather cart before horse. The sensible approach might be to wait and see whether 43 forces in England and Wales are going to be reduced to 12 or some other number – and then worry about the governance.
We need one police force for Wales and a Policing Minister elected to our national parliament. Like Scotland.
Not sure. Merging Gwent (far too small) with South Wales for sure. Maybe extend to include Carmarthenshire and Pembrokeshire; but less compelling case for including North Wales in my view. Scotland hasn’t been without it’s issues since they went to one force.
Its about democratic accountability. Policing is devolved in Scotland and accountable to the Scottish Parliament. In Northern Ireland the PSNI is accountable to the Northern Ireland Assembly, and in England they are now going to be accountable to the regional mayors. Where is the democratic accountability in Wales? Wales is not the only country in the UK with policing on its knees.
UK Labour continually betray Wales, and toothless Welsh Labour fail. Only a Plaid Cymru Welsh Government led by Rhun ap Iorwerth will fight for all our interests, be you Welsh or English speaker, from North, South , East or West Wales. It’s high time we put our interests first, because Labour , Conservatives and Reform UK never will! #PlaidCymru 🏴#RhunApIorwerth 🏴
Where is our First Minster in this debate? Does she ever stand up for our country? I forgot, when the Senedd elections get closer, we will see a different FM