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Opinion

Living and thriving with 20mph in Wales

26 Jul 2023 5 minute read
A 20 mph speed limit sign in Cardiff

Stephen Cunnah, Sustrans Cymru’ Policy and External Affairs Manager

Before 2017, I hadn’t given a great deal of thought to 20mph speed limits.

That changed when Cardiff Council introduced a 20mph zone in Canton, the area where I live.

I’ve spent the last six years living with my own young family in a 20mph community, as well as having regular conversations with neighbours, friends, and other parents, listening to and learning from their experiences.

I’ve been a keen and confident cyclist for a while, but since 2017, I’ve had two children and this significantly changed how I view things.

When I became responsible for protecting two young and vulnerable children, I had a heightened perception of risk.

Children display riskier behaviour because they’re still learning about the world and how to interact with it.

I know from experience how scary it is for a toddler to have a tantrum next to a busy road!

And even as they grow up, risks remain – I remember people in my family getting hurt on roads where I grew up in North Wales.

That’s why I feel thankful that my children have grown up knowing nothing but 20mph limits on the streets around them.

A calmer speed limit doesn’t eliminate all risks – nothing can do that completely – but there’s strong evidence that shows lower speeds result in fewer collisions.

Research by the Transport Research Laboratory, a private independent organization, has shown that there’s an average 6% reduction in collisions with each 1mph reduction in average speed for urban roads with low average speeds.

Good reasons to change our behaviour

When the 20mph zone was first introduced in Canton, the change itself and the need to adjust to it made me more aware of my driving habits.

I’m sure many other people drive more carefully and are more conscious of their speed now when driving in 20mph zones.

They’ve also helped me have confidence with my family and our travel habits.

I adapted my bike with one seat at the front and another at the back, and my daughter was riding with me from nine months old – I still remember how much she’d laugh from travelling around on the bike!

Both my children now attend school and nursery, and I’ve never felt the need to drive them to school.

They’ll walk with me or their mum, hop on the bike, or scoot to school – it’s not easy keeping up with them!

In the past few months, my son and I have started cycling on the road together.

He really enjoys it, it gives him confidence to travel semi-independently, and it brings us closer together by doing an activity together.

 Adapting to 20mph as a community

In the years since the 20mph zone was introduced where I live, the number of people not convinced by it has been exceptionally small.

Meanwhile, I’ve been struck by the volume of people wanting a wider coverage of the limit, better infrastructure to emphasize it, and more activity to enforce it.

This seems to be reflected in wider evidence too, where public approval for lower limits has gone up after they’ve been introduced.

In one study, approval was at 72% before and hit 80% six months after it was introduced.

When it was introduced in Canton, some residents were disappointed that it wasn’t rolled out soon enough on their own streets.

From my experience, very few people want speeding vehicles on their own street.

They want safer neighbourhoods for themselves, but also for the wider community.

Challenges facing the changes

From the start, the single biggest concern was that a 20mph speed limit would be ignored.

People wanted to see enforcement more than anything else.

Residents wanted speed cameras for 20mph limits, something that we’re still campaigning for.

Where in-person enforcement’s concerned, in 2017 South Wales Police wouldn’t enforce 20mph limits at all, saying it was a policy decision.

That’s now changed after community campaigning, but we still know that enforcement alone isn’t a silver bullet.

The police still use quite restrictive criteria for which roads they’ll carry out enforcement on, and these conditions rule out lots of urban streets.

And even where there is good enforcement activity from the police, we still see some drivers who choose to ignore the limit.

We know from data that a 20mph limit reduces average speeds, even without any other interventions.

Things aren’t perfect with the 20mph zone, and nobody’s trying to argue that it’ll solve every problem, but there’s some important things to remember.

There are – quite rightly – concerns with enforcement of 20mph speed limits, but these shouldn’t be taken as criticisms of the limit itself.

You see the same issues around enforcement in areas where the limit’s 20mph, 30mph, 50mph, or 70mph!

What the rollout in Canton has shown for me, my family, and the people who live here is that introducing a 20mph limit has meant where we live feels safer.

Change can be scary, or difficult to adapt to at times, but this isn’t anything groundbreaking – don’t we want safer streets for our children to play on?


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Philip Davies
Philip Davies
8 months ago

Much of what your correspondent writes is reasonable and unobjectionable. But there is always the overreach in all such nice, safe, child-friendly policies when adopted by government zealots. It is no longer enough to reduce traffic to a crawl outside schools – and other stretches of road where children, or indeed the frail elderly, will be expected to be crossing. That is an acceptable restriction on the motoring public, although a controlled crossing used to be the preferred method of ensuring safety at busy pedestrian areas, and seemed to work well. But, No – that is no longer considered sufficient… Read more »

Last edited 8 months ago by Philip Davies
William Rees
William Rees
8 months ago
Reply to  Philip Davies

Well said. The motorists needs are being trodden over by politicians who are not interested in fairness only in imposing thier dictatorial views on the public.And getting the benefit of taking in the money from more fines.

JimJam
JimJam
8 months ago

Interesting to see the debate from someone’s personal opinion, and that’s really all this is; anecdotal evidence of why 20mph limits are good. Whilst there is *some* evidence that it can reduce collisions (no such thing as accidents now – someone is ALWAYS to blame), the reality is that there’s at least equal evidence to suggest otherwise – collision rates increase due to complacency, either on the part of the driver, or pedestrian. Also, the whole climate argument fails scrutiny as well. Yes, it can help with pollution, but only under certain criteria, including road layout. Overall, the negatives of… Read more »

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  JimJam

 “Overall, the negatives of the 20mph limit will outweigh the positives, and that’s even assuming that the limit will be adhered to.”

This would of course be subject to your previous conclusion that it is
“someone’s personal opinion, and that’s really all this is;”
And without even anecdotal evidence to support the personal opinion that a 30mph limit is better!

JimJam
JimJam
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

Hmmmm … that’s not strictly true is it; there is plenty of evidence to prove that safety & environmental concerns are negatively impacted, I just didn’t link to them because I was posting a comment, not writing a biased article on the pros or cons. But thanks for your input.

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  JimJam

However the author of the article has gone to the trouble of providing a link to a report that has looked at evidence.

Maybe you could provide a link to some research that contradicts it.

If you think that the evidence to support your opinion is too much to include in a comments perhaps you could approach NationCymru with a view to submitting an article. Would make for an interesting read.

JimJam
JimJam
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

I’m a member of the Guild of Motoring Writers, I’ve researched this quite thoroughly over the years; there is plenty of fact based evidence on the subject. For every credible source promoting the cause, I can list an equally credible resource that shows a negative impact. Given the author of the article, I’d say there’s a chance there *may* be a hint of bias, just in the same way that if I wrote an article for NationCymru on the subject, I’d also lean to my side of the argument. To be clear, I am fully in favour of 20mph limits… Read more »

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  JimJam

Given that you are “a member of the Guild of Motoring Writers” and are someone with ” more than a passing interest in this matter,” I’m surprised that you are under the misapprehension that there is to be a “blanket solution”. https://www.gov.wales/introducing-default-20mph-speed-limits Provides information on the introduction of 20mph limits – reasons, maps, draft plans, details of the roles of local authorities and the need for consultations. Maybe you’ve (and others in seems) have confused “default” limits with” blanket” limits. Default means that there will be exceptions “blanket” means no exceptions. If it comes down to residents on a street… Read more »

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  JimJam

“For every credible source promoting the cause, I can list an equally credible resource that shows a negative impact.”

I have to comment on the absurdity of this statement.

Please provide a link to evidence that shows that being hit by a car travelling at 30mph causes less injuries and fatalities than being hit by a car travelling at 20mph!

Whiteman maleman
Whiteman maleman
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

Absurd is trying to design the world wr live in to ensure no one ever gets hurt everwhy not 5mph speed limits everywhere? Do you WANT children and old ladies to be killed in road accidents?!

I mean if you had any heart at all you’d be asking to ban all vehicles full stop. It’s much safer being struck by a pedestrian than even a bicycle, let alone a motorbike or car.

Absurdity indeed.

CapM
CapM
8 months ago

You’ve used the reductio ad absurdum tactic.
Basically attempting to take the discussion to a silly level.
Though you could have gone even sillier and proposed that pedestrians should be subject to speed limits.

Most usually reductio ad absurdum arguments are used by those who are unable to present logical; rational; evidenced arguments to support their own opinion.

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

You’re conflating speed limits with actual traffic speeds in that statement and therein lies the problem, that so many people do that.

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

In what way am I conflagrating it?

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

In Bath the average speed reduction of free-flowing traffic was 0.9mph, that’s for a 10mph drop in the speed pedestrians are being told to expect most traffic to be going, giving them a false sense of security.
Also even for a 1mph drop in speed, it’s the most dangerous drivers on the road who are least likely to modify their speed when limits are lowered and they’re also the drivers speed limits are normally there to single out.

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

https://www.20splenty.org/what_happenned_in_bath_did_deaths_increase

https://www.20splenty.org/banes-report

“A study published in the Bristol Medical Journal looking back over 20 years of data concluded 20mph zones had halved the number of children killed or seriously injured.

The data when competently analysed doesn’t support your opinion.

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

That was Bath’s own figures I think, often with these schemes even if the council’s most optimistic drop in average speeds is met it’s with the expectation that average speed will be well over the speed limit. The non-compliance is by design. Do you have an unbiased source? Mike Maher of the Atkins Report was pretty scathing of the way they only look at data that conforms to their bias. I’ve had to change my opinion on this before. Despite my bias being more towards putting more emphasis on the expectation of better driver behaviour. There is evidence that setting… Read more »

Last edited 8 months ago by Alex
CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

Your argument, when all’s said and done still appears to be-

Drivers won’t comply with 20mph default limits therefore 20mph default limits are a bad idea.

Which, forgive the idiom-
Is no way to run a railway.

DGDG
DGDG
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

20 or 30 mph, the biggest factor with regard to injury is the drivers reaction time. An alert and responsible driver can avoid or reduce the impact of a collision. Too much emphasis on the easy speed limit option.

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  DGDG

That’s incorrect. An “alert and responsible driver” having a collision at 30mph will have a greater impact than the same driver doing 20mph.

Slower reaction time makes the likelihood of a collision and the impact greater whatever speed being travelled.

You might like to suggest how reaction times could realistically be ‘policed’ in order to identify slow reactors at whatever speed they’re driving at..

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

While there may be evidence to suggest 20-limits can work on roads that already lend themselves to a lower speed, we’re not seeing 20-limits on roads that are nowhere near that standard and this can be dangerous.
It’s not a matter of how low you can set the speed limits, setting them too high or too low can increase the road danger.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/12/181212135021.htm

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

Thanks for the link. Unfortunately I can’t find the research paper it came from which means that it throws up a lot of questions. A main point that the summary hinges on is the “engineering recommendation” of a road which I assume is the speed limit that someone decided historically that the speed limit should be. It suggests a scientific approach but isn’t totally as it would be incredible if the science always determined that speed limits were multiples of 5. So the speed limits we have aren’t set by some physical law or constant and they are adhered to… Read more »

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

The reason why the previous 20 limit was abandoned in 1930 was because it was so widely disregarded. Initially, speed limits were revoked and replaced with the offence of reckless driving, 4 years later it was thought that some kind of limit was required so they introduced the 30mph limit for urban areas, this was set by streetlights rather than signs for the same reason the NSL sign is a symbol rather than a number. The road standard can vary greatly in urban areas so having a limit set by streetlights rather than a number makes sense and reckless driving… Read more »

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

“The reason why the previous 20 limit was abandoned in 1930 was because it was so widely disregarded.”

It was widely disregarded because it applied on ALL roads not just those in residential areas.

It was set at 30mph because there were few cars and most of those on the road took ages (relative to now) to accelerate.

“There used to be far more emphasis on the expectation people would adjust their speed on the conditions rather than the current drive-by-numbers mentality.”

And (relatively) there used to be far more ‘accidents’ as some would like them to be described as.

jack david
jack david
8 months ago

this is the view of a labour councillor. Who told me in an email. I was lucky to live in canton despite the bus services being poor lately. Also was in favour of a congestion charge.

Ap Kenneth
8 months ago

20mph as a driver will take some adjustment to driving style but we will eventually get used to it as the new normal. Changes to the Highway code a couple of years ago now, giving 2m clearance to cyclists or giving way to pedestrians when turning into junctions have not yet bedded in largely as a lack of publicity so that probably the majority are not aware of the changes, but it will happen eventually. It took 100 years of cultural change in motorists favour to land in the position we have now where cars dominate the urban enviroment, that… Read more »

Blinedig
Blinedig
8 months ago
Reply to  Ap Kenneth

Diolch. On a large estate I have seen many young children playing in the road, just as they would have done (safely) decades ago. Yet that estate is plagued by feral drivers roaring around, racing even. Even if the 20 limit reduces their default speed to 30, that would be an improvement.

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  Ap Kenneth

It’s not a matter of getting used to it, that also assumes speed limits exist to generally dictate speed, they’re meant to single out the small number of people who will drive recklessly fast. Most people default to the speed they feel comfortable driving at regardless of the speed limit, and that’s more down to how our brains function rather than willful disregard of the law, that’s why some of the higher standard 20-limits in Monmouthshire recorded 99% non-compliance. At that rate, the limit can no longer single out or target those who pose the most risk. The 30 limit… Read more »

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

The 30mph speed limit was set in 1935. Top selling car in 1935 was the Ford 8, top speed 60mph, 0 to 50mph in 36.8secs. Top selling car in 2022 was the Nissan Qashqai, top speed over 100mph, 0 to 62mph in about 8-10secs (depends on model). “Most people default to the speed they feel comfortable driving at regardless of the speed limit…,” I think it’s rather that most people are driving cars whose performance is practically beyond comparison with the performance of cars that were driven 90 years ago when the 30mph speed limit was set. The 30mph limit… Read more »

Philip Davies
Philip Davies
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

No-one would care to see a vintage Ford 8 racing through a residential area at 60mph either, so your argument simply doesn’t overturn the one ‘Alex’ proposes.

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  Philip Davies

You’ll find most people drive at speeds well down below 25mph on tight residential side streets, this law doesn’t prohibit people driving genuinely dangerous speeds more, it only pushes the prohibition onto the behaviour of the safer drivers on the road and forces the police to target them.

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

“this law doesn’t prohibit people driving genuinely dangerous speeds more,”

A different law punishes that – The Road Traffic Act 1988

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/section/2A

Give me strength!

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Philip Davies

The point that seems to escaping a few is that the 30mph limit was imposed when Ford 8’s were trundling along residential streets which were practically devoid of any parked cars to reduce visibility.

If cars with Qashqai performance existed in 1935 the speed limit would have been set lower than 30mph.

An age when cars are faster and have greater powers of acceleration demands lower speed limits in residential areas. This argument may appear counter intuitive but a lot of people have managed to get their heads around it.

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

The assumption being made that motorists are incapable of driving at a speed that’s appropriate for the conditions while simultaneously expecting them to slow down because the limits have been changed is counterintuitive. Speed limits aren’t meant to be a target speed, they’re meant to be the fastest you can go under ideal or at least favorable conditions. If there’s plenty of non-compliance with it, either the limit is wrong, or the design of the road is, something has to give. The way the limits are increasingly being set with indifference to the road’s design is in and of itself… Read more »

Last edited 8 months ago by Alex
CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

The Pygmalion effect would suggest that if we have a high expectation that drivers will adhere to the new 20mph limits then they will adhere to them. and If we have a low expectation that drivers will adhere to the new 20mph limits then they will not adhere to them. Speed cameras are going to decide whether high or low expectations “win”. Given the number of comments on this thread I’d be surprised if there were not a political dimension to this (I’m not accusing you of having a political agenda). Do you think that the Tory Party might ferment… Read more »

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

My politics is moderate I’m no Tory. My views on this come from having an examiner for a father. I often get frustrated with people who agree with me on speed limits because their reason for opposing it is very different to mine, this is called a concurring opinion. My issue with the ULEZ isn’t its existence, it’s the implementation, it comes in 24/7 from the start. I’d start it at rush hour times then all day then 24/7. Also, it’s a poll tax. It takes little account of how much the car fails by or the value of the… Read more »

Last edited 8 months ago by Alex
CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

You’ve dodged the question!

In Cymru ULEZ cannot be used by the Tories as a vote winner hence my suspicion that they will use 20mph limits here as a substitute. That’s why I mentioned it.

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

I thought you wanted my opinion on the ULEZ, I don’t care what the Tories think TBH. The Pygmalion effect doesn’t rely solely on people adhering to the law because it exists. If a law is perceived as contemptuous or unfair, it can lead to a loss of respect for that law, as it doesn’t inherently command respect on its own. Otherwise, one could argue for setting the speed limit at an even more unreasonably low value like 10mph and still make the same claim. This argument falls into the trap of appealing to the law without addressing the underlying… Read more »

Last edited 8 months ago by Alex
CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

“It’s important to recognize that a speed limit is ….” It’s important to recognize that the 30mph speed limit was set 90 years ago when road use, vehicle numbers and performances and many other things were very different to today. it’s also important to recognize that the 30mph limit was not some divinely inspired constant bequeathed to motorists as an inalienable right in perpetuity. It’s also important to recognise that motorists are not beyond the law and not beyond considerations for others they share roads with or are affected by roads. And it seems for some not beyond whining self victimisation… Read more »

Philip Davies
Philip Davies
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

The perfectly realistic capability of an old mass-produced Ford 8 to hurtle irresponsibly through the residential streets of 1935 at twice the long-established speed limit that is now to be reduced by 10mph shows merely that there were fewer cars then, so that the notional threat was seen as too remote a possibility to have become a concern. Experience nonetheless, unfortunately, shows there are now so many high-performance vehicles available to the general public which are capable of easily accelerating far beyond even 60mph that stricter policing is necessary than was the case pre-War. It is clear also that public… Read more »

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

The motorway speed limits you mentioned require average speed cameras and they have very much become target speeds.

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

I’m not clear as to what point you’re trying to make by introducing target “speeds” .
It seems to undermine your argument against 20mph.

Surely a “target speed” of 20mph on residential roads is better than a “target speed ” of 30mph.

Karl
Karl
8 months ago

It’s all s—-t safety my a—- more than half of wales will be banned within months when 20 mph goes live. Easy pickings for the paying motorist. Another way to controlling. 20 mph near schools yes totally agree not every street that’s pathetic. Country has gone to the dogs.

Frederick Ebene
Frederick Ebene
8 months ago

I did a FOI request for the baseline data this 20mph craziness is based on. That is, the number of people injured in 30 mph zones, how air quality was measured and the base line we are aiming for – for cleaner air. The Welsh Government was unable to give me this information. This is purely polictal to get less cars on the road and not for the ‘good’ of the citizen. Shame on the WG.

Joeboy
Joeboy
8 months ago

Fantastic to see someone writing sensibly about the 20 zone. I can’t wait to see it being rolled out and feeling safer on the narrow streets of Aberystwyth, where cars still have the absolute rule of the town.

Philip Davies
Philip Davies
8 months ago
Reply to  Joeboy

I’ve never felt threatened by the motor traffic in Aberystwyth. You must be one of those people with a nervous disposition.

Alex
Alex
8 months ago
Reply to  Joeboy

Do you think people drive at unsafe speeds because they can, is that how you drive?

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

They drive at speeds they think are safe.
That speed (and acceleration)is likely to higher the higher the car’s performance.
Anecdotally quite a few sports Range Rovers overtake me when I’m driving.
Being overtaken by a Honda Jazz, not so much.

Keith Parry
Keith Parry
8 months ago

Drakeford tells us he has no money to pay for meals for poor children in the summer holidays. Yet he has millions of pounds to waste on Sustrans and other parasite eco lobbying groups. This fellow will be lobbying for 15 minute cities, Low Traffic Neighbourhoods and Road Charging and other attacks on working class people who are paying taxes to support him. Time all this Net Zero nonsense was stopped.

Johnny Gamble
Johnny Gamble
8 months ago
Reply to  Keith Parry

Hello Keith, with Sidiq Khan expanding Ulez in London is this going to give Drakeford and Waters ideas!

CapM
CapM
8 months ago

Maybe after their glorious anti Ultra High Emissions Zone fired victory in Uxbridge, Tory sympathisers think that fermenting an anti 20mph limit here will bring them similar rewards.
Would that account for some comments?

Geraint
Geraint
8 months ago
Reply to  CapM

The Uxbridge seat has always been held by the Tories. Their majority at its lowest point was over 5,000 votes. The constituency has had to put up with the antics of Boris Johnson and still returned him to Westminster so I guess the left/ right vote is pretty embedded. The seat is one of those constituencies that recently has voted around 90% for the Tories or Labour. There has been little space for third parties. Having said that the Green and Liberal by-election vote came to around 1,400 votes and the Tory majority slumped to just under 500 votes. There… Read more »

Philip Davies
Philip Davies
8 months ago
Reply to  Geraint

Your last sentence raises the troubling issue of fire-raisers, not all of whom can have been silly children, the mentally disturbed or irresponsible campers and picnickers. There is growing evidence and some suspicious coincidences of timing and location about the spots where fires are being set which suggests deliberate criminality. The politics of zealots might well be a motive, today, when so many hold extreme views. This should at least be investigated. There is also the problematic ‘Green’ outlawing of the normal techniques for the safe management of woodland, forest and waste ground, whereby the removal or selective burning-off of… Read more »

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Philip Davies

On the other hand some won’t believe it until their @r 5e is on fire!

max wallis
max wallis
8 months ago

The author is not just a Labour Cllr but also Sustrans Policy&Public Affairs officer. Because of their conflicting interests, Sustrans appear unable to criticise those Labour Councils like the Vale of Glamorgan for trying to circumvent the Labour Govt’s 20mph legislation. The VoG official admitted to a FoE Challenge their 20mph exception Orders are NOT in line with the Welsh Government exceptions criteria as the VoG website states . https://participate.valeofglamorgan.gov.uk/20mph-speed-limit-exceptions-consultation They admit “inaccurate” but they’ve ignored the criteria and cannot produce the evidenced case required. The Community Council for St Nicholas on the A48 has commissioned a professional report which shows the… Read more »

Linda Jones
Linda Jones
8 months ago

Driving around Cardiff I see little evidence that people are following the 20mph speed limit except around speed cameras. Rather than a fixation with 20mph I would like to see the government and councils investing heavily in public transport so that less people need to travel by car, at 20 or 30mph. At the moment Cardiff Bus, owned by Cardiff Council is a joke. It’s expensive, unreliable and not fit for purpose. A good public transport system would take lots of cars off the road and make them safer for all. All we will need then is a road test… Read more »

Philip Davies
Philip Davies
8 months ago
Reply to  Linda Jones

The 33 million pounds the 20mph nonsense will consume of taxpayers’ money would have gone a long way to improving public transport in Wales, with just the effect you suggest. But of course the little Cabal in Cardiff are too excited by wielding the stick of power and intolerant compulsion to ever consider the carrot of real democracy and civilised encouragement.

Alex
Alex
8 months ago

This is written by someone who doesn’t even know the difference between a 20-zone and a 20-limit. It’s no good just reducing the average speed slightly because it’s the fastest 1-5% of drivers speed limits normally target who are the most likely to do harm and the least likely to slow down. The problem comes from making people feel safer. The assumption being made here seems to be that people will drive at unsafe speeds on the road due to a lack of signage to tell them not to. Traffic speeds have always been much lower on ordinary residential streets.… Read more »

CapM
CapM
8 months ago
Reply to  Alex

We’ll have to wait and see if what seems to boil down to a two pronged argument against the 20mph default –

Leave it to the innate judgement of drivers to drive slower than the 90 year old 30mph limit when they think it’s merited.
and
Drivers can’t or won’t modify their behaviour anyway

is successful.

Brian Flynn
Brian Flynn
8 months ago

Can anyone shed any light on this incredible story about Cardiff Council using diesel generators to power up their fleet of electric bin lorries?
Has the story been censored by Nation.Cymru ?
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/07/27/labour-cardiff-council-diesel-generators-electric-lorries/#comment

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